Norco with Nicole Kissler - Suitcases for Graduation
Hi. This is Ain't That Something, and I'm your host, Levi Smith, CEO of Franklin Building Supply. We're an employee owned building material supply company headquartered in beautiful Boise, Idaho. I'm a former ranch kid from Texas who found his way to Idaho and into leading this storied company. We're proud to be part of the fabric of communities we operate in and want to help share stories of other companies doing the same across this great state.
Levi:In each episode of Ain't That Something, I interview founders or leaders about the stories of companies you may be surprised to learn have either had their start in Idaho or now call Idaho home. In every interview, you'll hear about an interesting cast of characters, learn about daunting obstacles, and be inspired by the persistence it took to succeed. Get ready to be surprised and entertained with each episode of Ain't That Something.
Nicole:Ever since I was, you know, four years old, I felt like I wanted to be a part of Norco and be in this business. I was really fortunate because I felt like that thing kind of helped steer a lot of my decisions.
Levi:Today, I interview Nicole Kissler, third generation CEO of Norco. Now Norco may not be a company you're familiar with, but they're headquartered in Boise, Idaho, and today manufacture and distribute a wide variety of products and gases used in both industrial manufacturing and medical applications. You'll hear in this story how Nicole's grandparents moved across the country to buy this welding supply business in Boise back in 1968. At that time, it had two locations and 20 employees and just distributed products. We'll hear the story of how her grandparents and her dad and now her have taken the company over the decades since and turned it into a manufacturer of some of the products they sell into a company that has almost 90 locations spread out across the Northwest and in adjacent states, nearly 1,500 employees, and is a third employee owned.
Levi:So get ready for a fun conversation with Nicole Kisler, CEO of Norco. Well, I'm delighted to welcome you to the podcast today and hear a little bit more about your background and more about Norco. So I think it's always helpful to start understanding a little bit more about the person speaking. So what's your background? You grew up in the in the Boise area, but where did you go off to college and how did you end up back in the Boise area?
Nicole:Yeah. Well, thank you again, Levi, for reaching out about this. I'm flattered to be included and feel honored to get this time with you. So, yes, born and raised in Boise and feel very, very grateful for that. I love this area.
Nicole:My grandpa actually moved our family here back in 1968. And so then my dad and his sisters all grew up here, and then, I was born here back in 1985 and have lived here for that long. I went away to college. I went to Oregon State, go Beavers.
Levi:I really, it's in the Northwest, you know, so it's not that surprising. But what was the draw to Oregon State?
Nicole:Well, you know, I we went and looked at a bunch of different like state schools in the area and visited them. My family always kind of encouraged us to kind of go away from home. They weren't as forceful. You know, my dad jokes about how his parents gave him luggage as the gift for high school, right, to kind of encourage.
Levi:Doctor. It wasn't subtle.
Nicole:Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's time to, you know, fly the nest. So they encouraged him to kind of go outside of Idaho or the state, if you will, for whatever reason. I went and looked at different schools Utah and Arizona and Washington and kind of, again, still West Coast. But when I got to Oregon State, the campus was just so comfortable.
Nicole:I loved it. I loved the size of the town that it was in and that it was still close to like a big city and drivable in a day to get back to Boise. But it was just a really comfortable campus. And so I was excited about that. And I loved my time there.
Levi:And so you didn't have any family connection there. Where did your dad go to school? So when they gave him the luggage, and he had to leave, where did he choose to go?
Nicole:Yeah, so he ended up going to Washington State University up in Pullman. So and he loved that. When I took my family there this just this last month because we went to go see a football game, and I'd never been to the Pullman Stadium, but we got to go watch the Beavers play the Cougars, you know, the Pac two. Oh. So that was kind of fun to go see his old stomping grounds and walk around that campus a little bit.
Nicole:But yeah, he's a Cougar.
Levi:Diehard Cougar. So you go to Oregon State, you graduated with a degree in business administration, right? What drew you into studying business? Had you always wanted to study business early on? Kind of, know, is that something you're interested in even, you know, high school or earlier?
Levi:What was the draw to business?
Nicole:Yeah, you know, it was something that I, my dad's degree was in business, and so he kind of talked a lot about it and how applicable it would be, maybe no matter what I was kind of interested in. But, you know, my story is kind of different in the sense that ever since I was, you know, four years old, I felt like I wanted to be a part of Norco and be in this business. And so I was really fortunate because I felt like that then kind of helped steer a lot of my decisions. After high school, I knew I wanted to go to college, and I knew I wanted to study business so that I could come back and be a part of the family business. And so, again, I felt very fortunate in that sense because some people get to college and they're like, I don't know what I want to study, and it takes them a little bit longer, but I knew.
Nicole:So my time and energy didn't have to be focused on figuring out what I wanted that to look like. I could just put it into, you know, studying hard, getting good grades and going from there.
Levi:Why do you think, so, you know, your third generation family, right, in leading Norco today, and we're going to get to that part of the story, But so many people that come from a family business, especially once you get beyond the second generation, right? It's the grandkids of the founder, so to speak, regardless of whether they started or they bought the business. And we'll get into that part of Norco stories too. But so many third generation or fourth generation in many ways want to run away from the business. At four where you think you were drawn towards it, what drew you towards Norco where you go to college with that type of focus and direction?
Levi:Pulled you towards the business instead of pushing you away?
Nicole:You know, I'd always heard my grandpa, the way he talked about the business and how passionate he was, it made me really excited about it. And then again, watching, you know, my dad in the business and within the industry, and how much he loved it, that made me really excited. And so for me, it never really felt like any sort of like obligation, you know, as family business type of a thing. It was just, It was something that I really wanted to be a part of. I wanted to earn a way into the business.
Nicole:I wanted to be a part of Norco. And my interactions with the team and hearing from people in the community talk about the company, that was something that I always took a lot of pride in. And so again, it was always something that I was going to work really hard at because I wanted to get to be a part of Marco.
Levi:That's a lot of attraction to a business seeing your grandfather and dad and appreciating and respecting their roles in the company and that that broader impact and says a lot about both of them. Let's maybe go back to your grandfather for just a second. So that sounds like a special relationship. Help us understand your grandfather, and then we'll kind of thread into how he got into the industrial gas business. That's one of the two primary things that Norco does today, but help us understand your grandfather.
Levi:Who's, who's Larry?
Nicole:You know, and that's, again, another reason why I love getting to be a part of Norco and a part of these industries is I still get to hear stories about him, you know, from other peers in the industry or other vendors that have worked with him. And that is very fulfilling for me. I love getting to hear about him or things that he did in the community too, know, where he would attend and he would speak at different seminars. And so, that's another reason why I feel so fortunate. But both my grandparents, I love them, you know, unconditionally.
Nicole:They were amazing. And they made me feel, you know, unconditionally loved. But Larry was my grandpa and his wife, Fran, my grandma, they lived here in Boise. And so I kind of grew up getting to know them and getting to spend time with them. And they were wonderful.
Nicole:You know, my out of the two of them, my grandma was definitely a little bit more, I don't even know the right word. She was so witty and just treated us, you know, like grown ups, you know, from a very young age. She just would always be so great to spend time with. I loved, you know, getting to make bread with her and just do different things with her growing up. And same with my grandpa, you know, he would take us around when he would go to rotary meetings or when he would go spend time with his friends.
Nicole:And so we just always got to see how engaged they were with other people and the relationships that they had. And that was really important to me. And I feel very fortunate that I had those two great influences in my life very early on.
Levi:That is a blessing to have those type of people in your life, let alone grandparents. And it sounds like you're still maybe hearing, you know, some little story here and there, even today that you didn't know before.
Nicole:Yeah.
Levi:And, you know, a story that, you know, makes you, you know, just cherish and love them even more, as you hear about their impact with the company or employees or in the community.
Nicole:Yeah, every day. I love it. You know, we have a picture of them when we first walk into our main office, on our main office campus here, and I keep a picture right above, you know, my light fixture here in my office, too. Again, they played a huge role in my life growing up and the work that they did for Norco and for where the business is today. It wouldn't be here without that foundation.
Levi:And you said they moved to Boise. Where did they move from? Where were they originally from?
Nicole:So they moved all over. My dad jokes, he moved, he didn't live in the same place until after he graduated college because they would move every three or four years. So he was, I think he calls it a corporate brat where they just get moved around a lot, you know, because my grandpa was trying to move up in the business. After my grandpa graduated, he went to Washington State as well. So after he graduated from there, he went to work for a company called Union Carbide and kind of worked up through the business there and learned about the industrial gas business through that.
Nicole:And so but they met at Washington State and then lived in Seattle after that before moving all over the place. Know, my dad was born in Portland, Oregon. They lived in Boston. They lived outside of Chicago, you know, down in Utah. And my grandpa was fortunate.
Nicole:He had spent time with all these different distributors in his role. And so he kind of learned and that's where he wanted to kind of focus on putting a family business in place. And so he had found one in Boise, Idaho, you know, and moved the family out here in 1968. And it's always fun to talk to my dad about that story, how my grandpa came out here, you know, and decided we're making this move. Then my grandma loaded him and his three sisters up into a VW bus, they drove out across the country from Boston to Boise and made this their new home.
Levi:Wow. Just kind of back up and think about how bold and courageous that is to, you know, get get into a business in the way that he did, and and and we'll talk a little bit more about that. But move your family across the country and and in a VW bus of all things. I think they're mostly known for breaking down. You know, I know there's a lot of love and affection for VW buses out there, but I know enough of the owners to know that they don't they they never leave home without a full mechanic's tool set and ready to to do some road repair.
Nicole:Right. Well no no cell phones back then too. Right? So if something were to happen to them along the roads, you know, somewhere in the middle of nowhere, who would they contact or what would that look like? But yeah, my grandma was brave like that.
Nicole:I love the story where I heard she rode a bike from Boise to Emmett, again, back before cell phones, before any of that kind of stuff. She just was very adventurous, but, was willing to bring her young four kids out to Boise, Idaho.
Levi:So when the family moves to Boise in 1968, is it to purchase this industrial gas business from, I think it's the Nordling family that had an auto repair company and then had this Northwest oxygen company tied to that? I may have some of that wrong, but help me understand is did they move out here to buy that business and what was kind of the state of that business in 1968?
Nicole:Yeah, grandpa had identified this as a potential option to buy and he had to use an angel investor in order to make that transaction happen. That's not something that's talked a lot about, but David Nordling, he was the one that owned the company at the time, and he owned car dealership and then also or car repair, and then also owned this welding distributor ship on the side, kind of. And some of the vendors had said, Hey, you might need to break these things off. And so my grandpa was very interested in that and moved out here and ended up buying the business from David Nordlean in 1968 when it was two locations, one in Boise and one over in Twin Falls.
Levi:And how many people at that time with two locations? Ten, fifteen people?
Nicole:Yeah, I think they had about 16 people.
Levi:So he comes in 1968 to buy this business needs an investment partner to come along. That's additional risk that he's taking, not only moving the family doing this, but he had learned this business working from union car buyer with some of these, you know, folks that could maybe become, you know, customers, not things later. So the family shows up in 1968 takes over location, a company with two locations and 16 ish people.
Nicole:Yeah, was I seeing if I could find the number of people for that. Yeah. 20 people full time, two stores operating 20 people full time when we took it over.
Levi:Okay. So he comes in two stores, 20 people, and all of a sudden there's a new owner and new leadership in town and he's new to Boise. What have you heard the family say about those initial years just in terms of was that fairly straightforward for them? Was that an enormous challenge? Was it full of surprises?
Levi:What were those early years like coming to a new place, buying a new business, working with a new team?
Nicole:Yeah, well, I think, you know, I've talked to my dad a lot about this and I think the big change was moving from Boston to Boise, right? A little bit different. You know, they're pulling in on their VW and we didn't even have, you know, some of these other roads out here. They came in on Federal Way, and they're looking out the window of this VW and there's not a lot, there's not the buildings and everything that we have today.
Levi:It's not Boston.
Nicole:Yeah, exactly. It's not Boston, right? Yeah. Even my aunt made comments like the change in what we got to wear, you know, where she was coming in, you know, with skirts and boots and some of those things. They're like, Nope, everybody just wore jeans and t shirts.
Nicole:So just, and they were young kids, right? Know, moving into junior high and having to make new friends.
Levi:How old was your dad when they made this move?
Nicole:Let's see. So 1968. So he would have been 14. 14.
Levi:Okay. Yeah. And he was the oldest of the four?
Nicole:No. So he has three sisters. One was older, and then he's got two younger sisters.
Levi:Okay. So these kids are oldest is maybe getting into high school down into Okay. Gotcha.
Nicole:Yeah. And that's a tough time, right? Again, you're having to come to a new town, different part of the country and make new friends when you're, you know, probably had established relationships with people. I feel really fortunate that I got to grow up here in Boise and grow up with the same wonderful group of people. That was something that I love about having grown up in Idaho.
Nicole:I got to meet some incredible people and they're still friends, but he had to go and make new friends throughout moving around everywhere.
Levi:But he got to stay. He got to stay in a place finally.
Nicole:Stayed in Boise for four years before he then went off to college, right? Okay,
Levi:right. Before the whole suitcase thing and you've gotten
Nicole:And booted out of the house.
Levi:So those early years, a tremendous amount of change for your grandparents and your dad and his siblings to absorb. Help us get a feel for, you know, over those first kind of twenty, thirty years of the business, maybe particularly the first kind of those next kind of twenty years before your dad ends up purchasing the business from your grandparents. How did the business evolve? Did it grow quickly? Did it grow slowly?
Levi:Was it basically doing the same thing was doing when he bought it in 1968? What are those first ten, twenty years of business look like?
Nicole:All of the above, you know, kind of from my understanding. So when he first bought the business, he had seen how other distributors had been run, and so he could kind of bring some of that expertise to the table. And so I think they had to make some changes early on to make sure that they could continue to survive as a business. So sometimes that's tough to go in and say, Hey, we want to make sure that we're growing, that we're profitable so that we can keep growing. I had to make some changes early on and then went out and started to, again, had these great relationships, having spent some time in the industry, but meeting with people and then kind of acquiring businesses to grow.
Nicole:After he had those two locations, then were able to buy another business in Montana, I think next. But he would joke that that was what he got grandma for her birthday, right? You know, because all of their money, everything that they had put aside and saved, you know, was all going into the business.
Levi:Now, did you ever hear her side of that story? Did she unwrap that Christmas gift and think, Oh my goodness. How did you know?
Nicole:Made a lot of comments about those sorts of things like, Oh, I got a new truck this year for my birthday, you know, or whatever. And Her birthday was in July, right around July 4. My grandpa would always call her his little firecracker, but it was always so sweet because he would be like, Well, we just bought some new assets today for the company, some new cylinders. Happy birthday, Fran, you know, or whatever that looked like. And she was always a really, really good sport about it.
Nicole:Because again, she cared so much about the business and about the family.
Levi:They're all in on it. I mean, moved across the country. This is a family business all in.
Nicole:I feel very blessed to be a part of this family, but born into something where it really is that like American dream. You know, my grandpa going back to when he was a child and his family that came over to America and moved moved them all out to Odessa, Washington. Then he grew up there where his mom, she didn't even speak English. And so then he pursued college education after serving for the country and then getting involved in corporate America, if you will, pursuing this dream of just wanting to to create something for for his family in a community where he could make an impact. And and that's what he wanted to do.
Nicole:And so, a lot of hard work. And again, all in, like you mentioned, all in to do it.
Levi:It really fits that kind of story that we hear out there where you've got immigrants coming to The US doing the things that you just described. But sometimes I think it feels like a story and it's good to be reminded that it actually happened. It actually happened to a lot of people. And there are a lot of businesses today, whether they're second, third, fourth generation, or they've moved on from private ownership or other sort of forms who have that as part of their story. And the story of Norco is one of these stories.
Levi:It's not just something that's, you know, is out there and we've kind of lost connection to it because we don't, you know, that story is too many generations removed, but it's actually part of the Norco story. That really happens.
Nicole:Very much so. And we've been talking a lot about Larry and Fran, but when Larry moved out here, he was quick to try to surround himself with incredible people because he knew it would take a great team in order to get the business where he wanted it to go, carry out the vision that he had for it. So I think that's what he spent a lot of time doing too then, is again, building relationships and growing his people and putting a team in place. You know, he hired a president named Dan Steele, who was really, really great with people and from this area. And those two, they did.
Nicole:They spent the next however many decades growing the business.
Levi:Well, astute on your grandfather's part to know that it was going to take a great team to really be able to realize this vision and grow the business in a way that they, you know, they thought was was possible. Surrounding yourself with those those people. Know that's something that, you know, your dad continued and you've brought forward into your leadership that will unpack in a little bit here. But as your grandfather was growing the business and giving your grandmother Christmas and birthday presents with new assets that were acquired, were those other just, you know, industrial welding, you know, sort of gas supply businesses? Was the company during those first twenty years manufacturing any of the gas that it was distributing or that was coming from elsewhere and they were just a distributor?
Nicole:Early on, they were a distributor. That was a big piece of it. And again, my grandpa was really that visionary where he would have loved to be able to produce his own gas. But that was something that Jim, my dad, and his president at the time, Ned Pontius, put in place and made Marco a little bit more independent in that aspect. Kind of ventured off from buying all of that product to being a little bit more independent in this region and being able to build air separation units or plants.
Nicole:They were very much distributors in that sense. My grandpa had a couple of different sayings back at the day. Like he always would say, We're going to find a need and fill it. We're gonna talk to our customers about what they need, and we're gonna go after it and provide that for them so that they continue to choose us as their supplier. We we, as an organization at Norco, we put our customer at the top of the organization chart because they're the ones that really pay our paychecks.
Nicole:Right? We we say they vote with their dollars to choose to get to to do business with us. They it's their choice, the customer's choice.
Levi:And sounds like in those early days, they started to vote early and often with your grandparents. They like what they were providing, what the team was able to do.
Nicole:Yeah. We've always tried to focus very, very hard on service, right? I mean, that's been our mission statement forever, for as long as I'm known, is serving you better. And there's a lot in that. You know, that was the big emphasis was we're gonna go find a need and fill it for these customers.
Nicole:And then that hopefully they'll continue to want to work with us and keep coming back us. And that would make us, you know, grow and successful. And we'd be able to provide solutions, not just products, but solutions and have good conversations around solving customers' problems so that the customers could grow too, and growing together.
Levi:They really see you as an asset to their business where you're not just providing a product or service, you're really helping them also grow and achieve their goals, their ambitions as well. And that's when everything really starts to work well between two businesses. Think, you know, when your dad came in and really another gentleman, you know, was able to usher in the era of more vertical integration and manufacturing some of the product that you're selling. If we go back to your, your, your dad, you know, picking up his bags and leaving the doorstep and heading off to Washington State, what brought him back into the business? Was he like you were at four, he thought I'm doing this or did he venture off for a while?
Levi:How did he get back into Norco after he went off for college?
Nicole:Yeah. So again, my grandpa did some really great estate planning, read some great books early on. And so he kind of put some guidelines in place for us as a family to say, Hey, if you want to come back into the family business after college, you know, go work somewhere else. I was always under the impression that that was just to make sure that this was what we, you know, we could earn our way back into the business, go learn something that you can bring back and contribute. My dad a few years back had said, Hey, Nicole, that was always just to make sure that this is what you really wanted to do.
Nicole:If you're going to come be a part of the family business, you've got to love it. We want you to do it, you know, full heartedly.
Levi:Go- If you don't know, you don't know. So they wanted you to get exposure.
Nicole:Exactly. Right? Go see if there's something else out there for you that would be better or not. After college, Jim went out and he spent some time with a couple of different companies in different roles, not really related to Norcos industries, but management and sales. And then at one point, I think my grandpa called Jim and had the conversation with him and just said, Hey, is this something you'd like to come back and do?
Nicole:My dad was living over in Oregon at the time and decided to move back to Idaho and come be a part of it. And again, back to those kind of family guidelines. When you come back to the business, you don't automatically earn a role. You got to kind of interview for it and then move into different roles within the business.
Levi:More of a merit based model, even with family that would maybe have a right to come in. That's an owner's prerogative, but it doesn't necessarily win over the hearts and minds of employees or sometimes even customers. So your grandfather kind of established that merit model model pretty
Nicole:early Yeah, you know, am family, right? So I completely understand that. Like, I get that there's those. I was very fortunate. I had an early experience in my career when I was working for a company called Central Welding Supply over in the Seattle area.
Nicole:And I had worked with that company. Was wonderful. Their owner at the time had interviewed me and hired me and let me come and be a part of their team. And I started kind of in payables and got to spend some time in HR and doing different things. But when I was working there with him, I had this one experience that just kind of was game changing for me in the sense that he'd had an interview scheduled with an individual, and she came up the stairs and walked into his office as I was walking out and of looked around me and went in and sat down in the office.
Nicole:And so I went back to my computer and looked up who he was meeting with out of curiosity, and I saw her name. And she happened to be the sales manager's daughter at that time. I was like, Oh, that's why she got this interview. And it was how I felt in those fifteen seconds where I'm like, That's what everybody is going to think about me and feel about me. And so I got to experience that.
Nicole:And so I tried to bring that awareness or I tried to be aware of that in all of my interactions, you know, early on with Norco and to this day.
Levi:That's a valuable fifteen seconds of empathy right there, right? Know, connection and understanding how other people are going to feel in a situation and being mindful of that, you know, as you get into navigating that in your future, that's rarely do you get that good of a bang for about for fifteen seconds insight.
Nicole:Well, it's great because, know, she's still with that company and we're great friends, you know, like we have kids that are the same age and everything like that. But I was really fortunate that, again, just to have that perspective, because again, I'm third generation. I know the statistics around that. And I'm sure there's good reason for that.
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Levi:So you'll see the next episode when it arrives. So your dad comes back into the business when? I know he acquires the business in the mid eighties, but when does he come back to Norco, make that move from Oregon to Boise after that call with your grandson?
Nicole:Yeah. So that was, like, around 1983, I wanna say. Right. When I can fact check that date, it was early eighties, but moved back to Idaho, and then again, started in different roles and trying to just learn the business, learn, learn the customers, learn the product lines.
Levi:And how long did it take then for him to, you know, work his way up, get into that CEO seat and make a decision about buying the business? When did he become CEO? When did, you know, roughly, and when did he start working on purchasing the business from your grandparents?
Nicole:Yeah. So again, back to the astute state planning that my grandpa did, he had gotten some guidance around this. And so he had worked to sell the business to Jim very early on, I want to say 1985, you know, and then maybe took over the CEO role a little bit later, like early 90s.
Levi:So they'd already done a lot of pre planning for this. Like you said, your grandfather sounds like he's pretty financially astute, had taken some good advice from people and had really planned for this. Because this trips up a lot of family businesses. I think it's one of the things people don't necessarily appreciate or understand about family businesses. You know, sometimes from the first to second, and especially from the second to third generation, estate taxes and other tax related issues end up making it nearly impossible or make it very unattractive for a family member to be able to succeed their parents or grandparents.
Nicole:Yeah, he got some really, really good guidance early on around estate planning and worked with some really smart people in order to put the right things in place. And even around, you know, because again, my dad had three sisters, and any of them could have come into the business or any of their spouses, too, had they kind of followed some of those guidelines. They could have, too, if they'd shown an interest and wanted to be a part of it. And sometimes even that family dynamic then of saying, Hey, who's going to step into this role? Who's going to be the leader?
Nicole:What does that look like? That can create, again, family dynamics and stuff
Levi:Introduce just a little bit
Nicole:of time. Yeah, you know, we've seen that firsthand, working with other family businesses and hearing some of these stories and everything. So I think, again, it was great guidance that Larry provided to Jim and Jim's continued to share with us as a family and as a business. All those things, you have to have tough conversations to put it in place because, you know, by the time you get to a certain size too, it's not just your family. There's all the other families of your employees that are working there that are impacted by the things you do.
Nicole:So that's all very important.
Levi:So in the mid eighties, late eighties, as your dad is taking over ownership, taking over leadership of the company, at that point in time, the business has been operating for twenty ish years. When your dad comes in, what's the state of the business at that point? Do you have an idea of just kind of rough number of locations, people? It's still primarily focused on industrial still at that point. Had y'all gotten into medical?
Nicole:Gotten into medical before then. There were a couple of key individuals that had kind of pushed Norco. Again, we talk about finding a need and filling it, you know, and they saw that with the oxygen. We like to think that the gas piece really ties the medical and the industrial divisions together because otherwise they're very different, right? They're very different customers.
Nicole:They're very different.
Levi:Really have nothing to do with one another if they didn't have the gas Right?
Nicole:Very different, right? It's tough to be like, in one transaction, you walk into one of our combination stores and you're like, Okay, so I could get a breast pump and then turn around and the next transaction is going to be, you know, buying wire or, you know, so very different.
Levi:Tell me about this MIG welder.
Nicole:Very diverse in that sense.
Levi:So they diversified or started to diversify diversify into medical as well before your dad comes back in, but hadn't gotten into manufacturing gas at that point, still just a distributor.
Nicole:Yeah.
Levi:So what really led your dad into exploring becoming vertically integrated and becoming a manufacturer of the gases, or at least some of the gases that you're supplying? What kind of led him down that path?
Nicole:Yeah, again, I think that that was something that was a dream of Larry's, very visionary in that sense. And so the fact that Jim and Ned were able to make that dream a reality was really exciting, you know. And sometimes, you know, Jim would even joke and call it divine intervention of how some of the things kind of fell into place for that. Larry had Dan Steele, who was his president, help him run the organization. And then, you know, Jim worked very closely with Ned and, you know, they were, acquiring businesses and working to grow the company.
Nicole:And Ned had some background. And so when Ned came on, he had been working for other large gas companies as well.
Levi:He's the chemical engineer by training.
Nicole:Yeah, exactly. Had that background and had put those things in place. And so he helped Norco do that. And so now we have two operating air separation plants out here in the Northwest.
Levi:And I've heard, is this right? Do you refer to these as your two mechanical children? Yeah, you read that article.
Nicole:It's so true because I lose so much sleep over them and I worry about them. And when you hear they're running or not running or not working, you know, and just the time and energy that they seem to take up in this role is just one of those things. You love them, right? You know, they're They're part of your business, right?
Levi:But they're critical parts of the business today. Very much so. You have two of those in place. How long have those air separation units been in place and running at this point?
Nicole:I wanna say that, like, maybe about fifteen years, ten years, fifteen years.
Levi:What keeps you up at night about those air separation units? So we're we're joking kinda making light of them being your two mechanical children. What makes them really difficult? Because I think one of the things that's interesting about, you know, the fact that Norco is an industrial gas and medical and, you know, it's it's a business that for so many people kind of behind the scenes. And unless they're in that industry, they don't really think about.
Levi:And I think even fewer people think about, well, how do these gases even get made? For a lot of people, they just show up at a hospital and the gas they need is there and they're not really thinking about it. Maybe the industrial people think about a little bit more. I'm not sure because it's an everyday thing. But in either case, the average person, myself included, knows very little about how these gases are made.
Levi:You know a whole lot more about it. Help us get a little smarter here. You know how those work from a business standpoint and what keeps you up at night, so to speak, as you think about those two facilities?
Nicole:Yeah, well, I think what you said is that, Like, there's so many different applications for gas. You know, I can drive from my house to work and drive by so many different customers that use the gases that we produce. But it is that oxygen, right? You know, it is something that is life sustaining and these hospitals rely on it. So if something were to go down, being able to make sure that they had the product that they needed for life.
Levi:This product isn't a luxury.
Nicole:Yeah. Right? It's not with the For the
Levi:people that need it, there's not a substitute.
Nicole:Because you're thinking about we're sitting here, we're breathing oxygen, right? But it really is one of those things that the number of applications and the things, the businesses, the processes that we are a part of, that we get to be a part of, like, it's so cool. It's so cool, and it's so easy to get passionate about. And I learn every day about a different customer or how the product is being used, how the molecules are being used. And and that in and of itself is really exciting.
Nicole:But then you think, well, but if they don't have the product that they need when they need it, like, what does that mean for their company, for their business, for production, or for sustaining life? You know, all those different things. That's just a little added pressure, if you will, on making sure that that we can get the customers what they need when they need it.
Levi:Almost feels like, yeah, if you're responsible for providing, you know, clean water or maybe it's the electric grid, other things that we think about as, you know, maybe public utilities or infrastructure, we think it'd be difficult to go for very long without those things. You're providing a product to a supply chain and to end users who also have no real substitute for what you're providing and need it to be able to either function in their business or you're talking about like the hospital or people that your company might be delivering a tank of oxygen to, you know, at a home or whatever it is. And there's this dependency, there's this real need that you're you're meeting that again, isn't isn't just a want to it's a it's it's something that they absolutely depend on and require.
Nicole:Yeah, and again, we're grateful to get to be a part of all of those different processes, right? Again, I think it's so cool when I can talk to my kids or I get to go into their one of their classrooms, you know, and talk about all the different things that gas is used for, you know, whether that's nitrogen or oxygen or argon or CO2 or just, you know, helium, all these different gases. But it does it just it makes things you know, we always wanna provide great service, right? That's something I think that differentiates us just a little bit. But understanding when people need it, how much they need it, being that expert that they can rely on for these things too is important and something our team takes a lot of pride in.
Nicole:I know there's a lot of other needs out there too, you know, in the world. And so I'm saying not that we're any different than those. It just adds an element where, again, you want to be the best at what you're doing for your customer's sake, for the communities. And so that's important to us.
Levi:Well, helps us understand that, you know, two mechanical children a little bit more, because I think there is a weight that comes with that. I think any of us in business, recognize there are people depending on us every day who are, you know, getting our products or services. But some products and services are more critical and have fewer substitutes or have a smaller margin for error. So, you know, that's interesting with y'all's business that you really have that additional kind of, you know, pressure and weight, but, you know, work to to make sure that the, you know, delivery of those products and services is not, you disrupted. So your dad and Ned Pontius, you had mentioned earlier, are in the business getting Norco vertically integrated.
Levi:You're making these gases, you're distributing in industrial medical channels now. So there's a, you know, twenty five, thirty years or so that go by before you realize your dream as a four year old to come back into this business. So you mentioned earlier that you, you graduated college degree in business administration, go to work for a couple other companies. I think in addition to the welding supply company, mentioned you also spent some time at Target. Is that right?
Nicole:Yeah, correct.
Levi:Okay. So you get some experience outside the business. What is the trigger for you coming back into the business or back home in that respect? And, you know, was it 2014 or '15 or so that you really came back and started to work your way up in Norco? What was the trigger and where did you come in and start?
Nicole:Yeah, so my dad called me. Was living over in Seattle at the time, and my dad called me, and I think it was like October 2013. And he said, Hey, do have any interest in coming back and moving back to Idaho and working in the business? And, you know, that was, again, my dream and something I'd always worked for. So I was really fortunate when I shared that information with the individual or the leader of the company that I was at over in Washington.
Nicole:He could have just said, Okay, you know, CEO, or Thanks for nothing, or whatever that looked like. But instead, he was like, Hey, we have to cram as much more knowledge, you know, much more experience and as much knowledge into you as we possibly can in these next two months so that you feel like-
Levi:Oh, That's a generous
Nicole:Oh my gosh, it was incredible, right? I'm so grateful for that opportunity. And that's kind of what we did over the next two months is he let me go out with salespeople, and he let me meet customers and spent more time with vendors and spent time with the team and just continued to learn as much as I could before I came back. And then, you know, again, going kind of back to our guidelines, so then I had to call an interview with branch manager here in the Boise area, and kind of start in more of like an entry level role, which was great. That was what I needed, because I didn't have any medical experience, right?
Nicole:You know, we got into the medical business back with my grandfather there who was running the business. I didn't have any experience. And thankfully, the team out there was willing to let me come and be a part of it, you know? And so I worked in that Meridian branch and started, you know, in customer service, answering the phones before I could move to the front counter and actually face to face interactions with customers and learn the products and learn the team and learn more about Norco. Was great.
Levi:And how long did it take you then as took on those different roles, get exposure to different aspects of the business, earn your stripes, that merit based system that your grandfather did such a great job of establishing expectations for? How long did it take you from when you came into Norco to your dad feeling like and you feeling like is the right time for you to step into the CEO seat and lead this story company today? Well,
Nicole:I don't think you're ever really ready for a role like that. You know, I think you And I think that was my experience with Norco is every time you start to kind of get familiar or feel comfortable in something, then I would move into a different role. And so my first five or six years with the company, I never felt great at any of my roles. You know, it was just kind of thrown into something new. And again, I felt so supported by the team here that that was okay.
Nicole:Because I think as human beings, you want to be good at what you're doing, And you when you never have that confidence to say, Yes, I feel 100% comfortable doing this, you just kind of feel like, Oh man, how am I going to be successful in this? But it was great. I, again, loved the people piece so much. There were so many wonderful people. And so I spent time in various roles, you know, worked in revenue cycle.
Nicole:It felt like if there was something that Norco was maybe struggling with, or an area of opportunity as a company, I worked into that and worked with teams and worked to figure it out together, and again, was just surrounded by so many incredible people throughout all of those different positions, because I probably changed roles four or five times. And then in 2021, like midway through the year, it was just kind of a conversation that Jim and I had had. And he said, Maybe it's time for you to step into this role. And again, you never really feel ready to take on a role like that. It's a dream.
Nicole:And I had gotten really good advice from a current board member now who said, you know, when you step into this role, you know, give yourself grace period, right? It's going to take you two to three years to really feel comfortable in the role, to get the right people in place, right support systems, to ask the right questions, all those sorts of things. And so in hearing that, because I always try to think long term, right? I've never as a almost eighty year old business, you know, seventy plus year business, we always try to think long term. And I think that that's been very beneficial to me because I'm not having to just appeal to something next day or whatever that looks like.
Nicole:Get to give yourself a little bit more grace to say, we'll work through this, we'll ask questions, we'll get better, you know, back to our mission of serving you better. We're constantly looking at continuous improvement. And that's just what I want to keep doing is keep getting better
Levi:in a business built over decades, not months and years since that long term orientation that you're, you know, a third generation steward of, I love that approach of mentality. And I'm sure that resonated well with your employees, too. Great advice from that board member where there's so much pressure to do everything yesterday, especially I think in a CEO leadership seat that if you take this long term orientation, we've been doing this for more than seventy five years We want to press, there's a sense of urgency, but we'll give ourselves some time.
Nicole:Yeah, learning patience, right? And I have little kids too. I mean, had a three year old and I had a, she just turned one and-
Levi:A few things going on and the two
Nicole:mechanical children. Yeah, five, right? So I've got three kids now, now little, you know? And so anyway, that was the timing on all of that to figure out motherhood, you know, which you don't get any sort of guidelines or guidance on, right? You just figure that out as you go.
Nicole:And then to take on a role too. Again, I I couldn't have done it without incredible support and and the people within Norco and and around me. It's great.
Levi:So some of the support that y'all have today, couple of things I wanna hit on before we wrap up our time today. I think about the time that you came in, y'all also became 35% ESOP. Is that right? Yeah. So 35% or so employee owned.
Levi:Give us just a feel for how you think that's impacted you know, the company organization that kind of buy in. So now employees aren't just waged employees, which is great, but they also get to share in some of ownership. Until that point, really only your family had shared in, you know. So how's that impacted the business?
Nicole:Yeah, that was that was significant for Norco. And so that happened prior to my CEO role or transition. Jim kind of made that decision back in 2015 to make a third of the business employee owned.
Levi:Right after you came in?
Nicole:Yep. Yep. It was about a year and a half into it because it was all part of transition and succession planning and and all of those things. You know, it all played into the to the decision around that. And, the people at Norco, we have the most incredible people.
Nicole:There are people here that are celebrating, you know, they've spent more than half their life, not just half their career, but more than half their life working for this company, you know, so they've always been invested in it. And so as a company or as a family, we wanted to show that we were investing in them. In doing that, we became an ESOP or in this employee owned company, and that's been great. Think the world of, again, the people that are a part of this, and they treat this business like it's their own. They're owners.
Nicole:They've got that ownership mentality, and they ask good questions, and they make good decisions. And that was big for Norco, really big for Norco. Yeah, that happened back in 2015. That's one
Levi:of the fun things about employee owned company. Know, obviously, I shared that with y'all, being an employee owned company.
Nicole:I know, I love the timing on that too.
Levi:Right, yeah. Similar timing for us, but I think being able to ask people to not just think like owners, but to think as owners. And the difference between like and as is night and day Because asking waged employees to pretend like they're owners is maybe not a bad ask, but it gets a different result than asking an employee to think as an owner when they actually are. They're going to be the beneficiaries or recipient, whether it's a third employee owned or 100 or anywhere in between, they're be a going beneficiary or recipient of the success of the business in a way that goes above and beyond being a wage employee. Yeah.
Levi:You know, think y'all have done a fantastic job of really just integrating that into your culture and communicating that very effectively to the community in a way that resonates, you know, with people. Because at this point, you've got, is it 90 locations and 1,500 or so employees or even more? I mean, Norco is no is not a two location 20 employee outfit anymore.
Nicole:Yeah, we've almost we're a little under 1,500 employee owners. And now we're in, you know, eight states in the Northwest. And so we love this area. And hopefully, it kind of changes people's mentality to where they're thinking long term, right? If they're contributing and part of something where they feel like they're making that impact, which they are every single day helping our customers and working with their fellow employee owners, and then they're getting to kind of generate that wealth for themselves or for their family long term, I think that's hopefully, again, something that they feel really good about and feel like is providing purpose for their life.
Levi:And that impacts not only them, their families. It impacts customers because of how the employees think about their work every day. It impacts the community in terms of those dollars and that mentality being reinvested and put back into the community. I think that's a great note for us to end on. I just want to tell you, I really appreciate you taking some time to kind of peel back the curtain and get us more familiar with you than also the story of Norco going from this company bought by your grandparents in 1968 to what Norco is today.
Levi:A big thank you to you and just a congratulations to you, your dad, your grandparents, and all the employees that make Norco what it is. You've got a great organization, something to be extremely proud of.
Nicole:Well, thank you, Levi, for your team and for wanting to share Norco's story. Anytime we can talk more about it. Again, it's easy for me to get really passionate about it because I love the work that we do and the people that are doing it. We're grateful to have you as a leader in this community too. Thank you for all that you're doing.
Levi:Thank you. Thank you for listening to this episode of Ain't That Something? If you enjoyed the episode, please consider subscribing to the podcast in your listener and sharing the podcast or this episode with others. Thanks again to our season sponsor, TrustJoyce, and to our guest for graciously sharing their time and story. So go start, create, or build something surprising so I can share your story.
Levi:Until next time.
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